Premiums rising for physical silver (and gold)

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Unobtanium said:
... Having a tough time finding any other mints that have suspended production. ...
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The Swiss Canton of Ticino, in the Italian part of Switzerland, has just ordered the gold refiners based there to close, initially to March 29th but this is expected to be extended. Three of the world’s largest refiners – Argor, Valcambi and PAMP are based in Ticino. ...
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https://kingworldnews.com/breaking-...d-swiss-gold-refiners-have-ceased-production/
 
...
Ludwig Karl ...

He’s a board member of Swiss Gold Safe Ltd., an operator of high-security vaults in the Alps that’s storing growing sums of precious metals for wealthy foreigners as the Covid-19 pandemic worsens. The company usually helps customers buy gold, but governments have closed scores of businesses amid the crisis, making it increasingly difficult for people to get their hands on the physical product.

“It’s absolutely crazy what’s going on,” Karl said. “Right now, if somebody wants to buy gold, I wish them all the best in finding it. Most of the bullion dealers are closed.”
...
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https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...stuggling-to-get-hold-of-gold-in-crazy-moment
 
If you think gold GC00, +1.91% has jumped about 10% in a couple of days to $1,638 an ounce, the official price quoted on Wall Street, think again.

The real price? Nearer $1,800. If you can get it.

“There’s no gold,” says Josh Strauss, partner at money manager Pekin Hardy Strauss in Chicago (and a bullion fan). “There’s no gold. There’s roughly a 10% premium to purchase physical gold for delivery. Usually it’s like 2%. I can buy a one ounce American Eagle for $1,800,” said Josh Strauss. “$1,800!”

Major gold dealers have sold out of coins and gold bars amid panic buying as the U.S. economy plunges and the government agreed to a record $2 trillion emergency lifeline.

Kitco, the Canadian gold dealing giant, reported Wednesday that it was out of almost all standard one ounce gold coins. American Eagles and Buffaloes, issued by the U.S. Mint, were out of stock, it reported. Ditto Canadian “Maple Leafs,” issued by the Royal Canadian Mint, “Britannias” issued by the Royal Mint of Great Britain, and “Kangaroos” issued by Australia.

It was out of Krugerrands, issued by the South African government. Those are by far the most widely traded gold coins in the world.
...
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https://www.marketwatch.com/story/t...n-dealers-sell-out-in-panic-buying-2020-03-25
 
Gold suppliers are in talks to use chartered or cargo flights to transport the precious metal, which usually moves around the world in commercial planes and has been left stranded as global travel grinds to a halt.

The global gold market has been thrown into upheaval by the coronavirus outbreak. Logistics are becoming increasingly difficult and some leading refineries have been forced to close, all at a time when demand for gold is surging. A key South African refinery said Thursday it’s had to stop shipping to London.

The London Bullion Market Association, which represents gold market participants, said that refining capacity isn’t a problem -- there’s easily enough plants still operating to meet demand. However, the group is looking at ways to solve the logistics problems and is investigating the possibility of allowing global delivery outside of London.

“LBMA is confident there is more than sufficient global refining capacity,” it said in a notice issued overnight. “Refiners and other market participants are actively engaged with logistics companies to overcome travel constraints and ensure the physical movement of metal via, for example, chartered or cargo flights.”

The disruptions in gold supply chains have combined with surging demand for the traditional haven to drive prices higher. Spot gold is headed for its biggest weekly gain since 2008. Earlier this week, uncertainty over whether there was enough gold available in New York to deliver against contracts on the Comex drove the spread with London spot prices to the highest in four decades.
...
While tightness on the Comex may be easing amid signs that investors are rolling April contracts into June, the constraints on transporting gold remain in place. Some wholesalers and retail dealers have said they are running out of the metal and South Africa’s Rand Refinery Ltd. is exploring back-up plans and alternative measures to be able to meet its delivery commitments to the London gold market after commercial flights dried up.
...
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https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...ghts-for-metal-stranded-by-virus?srnd=premium
 
...
“People want to buy, not to sell gold,” said Mark O’Byrne, the founder of GoldCore, a dealer based in Dublin. “We have a buyers’ waiting list and we emailed our clients seeing who wished to sell their gold. At this time there is roughly only one or two sellers for every 99 buyers.”
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https://news.goldcore.com/us/gold-blog/gold-and-silver-coin-and-bar-premiums-what-is-happening/

...
Credit Suisse Group AG, which has minted its own bars since 1856, told clients this week “not to bother asking” for gold bars.
...
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https://news.goldcore.com/us/gold-b...dit-suisse-tell-clients-do-not-bother-asking/

The Perth Mint, Australia’s largest, reported a jump in gold and silver sales last month as demand for havens surged amid the coronavirus pandemic.

The mint, which has been in business for more than a century, said gold coin and minted bar sales totaled 93,775 ounces in March, the highest since April 2013, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. Silver sales almost tripled to 1.74 million ounces from 605,634 ounces in February.

The mint’s gold kilobars were sold out last week due to the surge in demand amid a squeeze in the market, according to Chief Executive Officer Richard Hayes. It has reopened the kilobar manufacturing facility to ensure additional stock is available, and separately has diverted production to its popular 1 ounce Silver Kangaroo coin to meet a backlog of orders, he said last week.
...
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https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...n-gold-silver-sales-as-pandemic-hits-k8h0km3y
 
Just looking at the Bullionvault live order board ( think its secure, available once logged in ) and in Singapore bids are about £40 higher, offers around £90 higher than the chart price of gold. There doesnt seem to be any action there but this could be because its the middle of the night.

London, New York and Zurich bids / offers all around the £1300 mark as per the Bullionvault chart.
Which seems to suggest that there are willing sellers .........
 
Been watching Provident and Apmex prices for 1 oz random year gold eagles.

Over the past couple weeks or so, both dealers have been posting a spot price that has been running approx $10 to $40 above the Kitco ticker spot price.

Right now Provident spot is running $20 above Kitco spot and Apmex at $30 above Kitco spot.

For the past couple weeks, Provident 1 oz gold eagles have been running $100 above the Provident spot price, and right now about $120 above the Kitco spot price.

For the past couple weeks, the Apmex 1 oz gold eagles have slowing increasing in delta price above spot. Right now the coins are running at $185 above the listed Apmex spot, and $215 above the posted Kitco spot.
 
Coins / gold in the hand seems to be where the disconnect is and I read something yesterday suggesting that its logistics rather than shortage per se.

Bullionvault and Goldmoney will allow you to take delivery but leaving it in their private but registered vault, lets you sell it via the internet to a reasonably wide market any time ..... as long as tinternet is available ........
 
For the first time in over 2 weeks, the Provident metals price for a 1 oz random year gold eagle is now running at over $100 from their listed spot price.

As I mentioned in the earlier post, Provident had been showing a price of $100 above their listed spot price, for the past 2 wks.

As of today, the 1 oz RY gold eagle price is $140 above their listed spot price.
 
...
According to media reports, one of the world’s biggest precious metals refiners PAMP said that it has been given approval from the Ticino Council in Switzerland to partially restart operations.

A spokesperson told Bloomberg that the company will operate at less than 50% capacity to safeguard employees and the community. The company will also operate and fully comply with local government requirements.
...
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https://www.kitco.com/news/2020-04-03/PAMP-restarting-limited-operations-reports.html
 
...
Valcambi and Argor said on Sunday they had received government approval to partially reopen on April 6. PAMP said on Friday it had permission to restart.

They said this was on condition that they observe more stringent hygiene and safety measures.

Valcambi and PAMP said this meant they would operate at less than 50% capacity. Argor said it would have a “reduced work regime”, splitting staff into three groups working separate shifts.
...
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https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-p...s-to-reopen-at-reduced-capacity-idUKKBN21N0AZ
 
I reckon the futures markets will take care of things

I mean its not like they actually need any to make stuff cos everyone is on Gaia Break .....
 
rblong2us said:
...
I mean its not like they actually need any to make stuff cos everyone is on Gaia Break .....
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Supposedly, 480toz of silver needed to make every Tomahawk missile. You think the war machine is going to stop because grandma has the sniffles? /snark
 
I suspect the silver needed to make missile circuits is secured well ahead of production.
It would be hard to run a war machine on justintime procurement ..........

especially if it ended up having to be shipped by the current 'enemy'

And I think the 'war' is probably on a go slow at the moment, just dont tell the 'enemy' weve got a little flu problem though.
 
3/28:
PMBug said:
...
I was shocked by what I saw this morning:
  • 10 ozt gold bars - Zero inventory. Few items offered for "pre-sale" on expected future inventory. Premiums ranged from $47.8 to $97.8 over spot
  • 1 ozt gold bars - Zero inventory. Few items offered for "pre-sale" on expected future inventory. Premiums ranged from $50 to $80 over spot
  • 100 ozt silver bars - Zero inventory. Few items offered for "pre-sale" on expected future inventory. Premiums ranged from $4.49 to $5.49 over spot
...
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4/10:
  • 10 ozt gold bars - 11 bars Apmex poured. Premium $100/toz over "spot"
  • 1 ozt gold bars - 88 bars RCM. Premium $100 over spot
  • 100 ozt silver bars - Zero inventory. One item offered for "pre-sale" on expected future inventory. Premium $4.49 to $5 over spot

Apmex lists "spot" gold at $1,704.60. I don't know where they are pulling their data from as Spot should be $1,685 and Futures are $1,750.
 
...
The U.S. Mint said Wednesday it’s temporally halting production at its West Point facility in New York because of the risk to employees from the coronavirus. The site makes gold, silver, platinum and palladium coins which are sold through a network of distributors.

The shutdown comes as convulsive swings in financial markets spur a surge in demand among retail investors for precious metals as haven assets. Last month, the Mint said it sold out of American Eagle silver coins, while the gold coins it offers were snapped up in March at the fastest pace in over three years.

“The timing is awful,” said Everett Millman, a precious-metals specialist at Gainesville Coins in Florida. “It’s going to exacerbate the supply shortage” in the coin market when demand is soaring.

Premiums for gold coins are at 5%-10% over spot gold, compared with less than 1% in normal circumstances, Millman said. ...
...
The Mint had previously redirected some silver bullion production to its Philadelphia facility, Michael White, a spokesman, said in an email. During the temporary suspension of operations at the West Point facility, it will continue to make American Eagle and America the Beautiful silver bullion coins available to its network of authorized purchasers. American Eagle and American Buffalo gold coins will not be available, White said.
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https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...n-output-just-as-investors-are-demanding-more

The last time I visited my LCS, they didn't have any gold eagles. They only had a few gold maples. I think retail stock of gold eagles was pretty much already wiped out.
 
4/28:
  • 10 ozt gold bars - 65 bars (mostly misc brand). Premium $80/toz over "spot"
  • 1 ozt gold bars - 0 bars - presale only. Premium $110 over spot
  • 100 ozt silver bars - 15 bars secondary market. Premium $3 to $3.5 over spot

~~~

...
Consumers who want to buy gold coins typically have to pay more than the per-ounce prices quoted on financial markets in London and New York. That premium has jumped to $135, more than tripling from two months ago, said Robert Higgins, chief executive officer at Argent Asset Group LLC in Wilmington, Delaware.

“There has never been a time for American Gold Eagles at this premium level,” Higgins said in an interview, referring to the popular U.S. bullion coin.
...
Gold-coin premiums tracked by Certified Coin Exchange are at the highest levels in six years, data from the bourse show.

Last year, bar and coin demand fell by 20% to the lowest level since 2009, hurt by costlier prices that discouraged retail bullion buying globally, according to the World Gold Council. That began to reverse in 2020, with investors snapping up coins sold by the U.S. Mint in March at the fastest pace in over three years.

Higgins, a 40-year industry veteran, operates a wholesale business that typically deals with an average of 1 million to 1.5 million ounces of gold each month. That jumped to more than 6.5 million ounces in March as premiums surged, he said.
...
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https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...forking-over-lofty-135-premiums-for-u-s-coins
 
5/16:
  • 10 ozt gold bars - many bars (at least 100) various brands. Premiums started at $67/toz over "spot" and averaged around $80
  • 1 ozt gold bars - Many bars (over 400) various brands. Sale item was $60 over spot. Regular priced items started at $80 over spot
  • 100 ozt silver bars - 15 bars secondary market. Premiums started at $3.10 over spot

I didn't do a full inventory accounting. Looks like they had a lot more gold inventory and were still running lean on 100oz silver bar inventory. Premiums looked to have dropped a little bit on gold, but were slightly higher on the silver.
 
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