Switzerland: Referendum on prohibition of gold sales by SNB, storage only in CH, min. 20pct reserves

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Thanks Benjamen. I rarely read the PM Bug or Gold threads (obviously).
 
The idiots who are managing the campaign have counted more than 15000 signatures twice. Now we're short 2000 signatures with just 7 days left to get them, ie we got 98000 valid ones. This means I'm gonna have to chase people in the streets for the next week in order to get more signatures. Yikes!
 
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How about an op-ed in a local paper?

Obligatory:

 
PMBug said:
How about an op-ed in a local paper?
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It's all over the news, so there's no need for that.
The problem is to get people to sign rather than just to take notice. That's why we're running arround the streets to get signatures. It's looking good so far. But I'm gonna go collecting tomorrow again. It's tough distracting shoppers from new iphones and mc donald's, though.
 
Good luck SA!
Important work you're doing, both for your fellow Swiss citizens & I think it has larger implications as well.
 
We got 105'277 valid signatures deposited with the federal government of Switzerland today. It's gonna be voted on either in autumn or next spring.
 
As you probably know, Switzerland is devided into 4 language regions (ordered by population): German, French, Italian, Romansh (a mixture of Latin, German and Italian).
I'm living in the German part.
The public television of the French part got access to the SNB's vaults just hours after the signatures were given to the federal government. I actually guess that it was taped earlier. The French part of Switzerland is known to vote against conservative causes in popular referendums, it's heavily progressive leaning. That's probably the reason why only the French part got to see this piece. GATA brought this to my attention:

Swiss gold reserves make TV appearance hours after repatriation petitions are filed

Submitted by cpowell on Sat, 2013-03-23 15:58. Section: Daily Dispatches

11:57p HKT Saturday, March 23, 2013

Dear Friend of GATA and Gold:

Our friend A.L. reports that the French-language state television service in Switzerland mysteriously gained access to a Swiss National Bank gold vault somewhere in Switzerland just hours after the Swiss gold repatriation movement filed the petitions necessary for a referendum on protecting the national gold reserves. The broadcast seems similar to the propaganda campaign arranged back in December by the Bank of England as concern about the simple existence of Western central bank gold reserves burst into the news:

http://www.gata.org/node/12030

Video of the Swiss broadcast is posted at the Radio Television Suisse Internet site here:

http://www.rts.ch/video/info/journa...contenue-dans-plusieurs-depots-en-suisse.html
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http://gata.org/node/12378
 
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That's OK. Everyone knows the French always lose. /:rimshot:
 
Do you know, my swiss friend, if all questions (retreat of gold reserves, ban of gold sales and rule that snb must hold 20% of reserves in gold) at referendum would be voted together or each question would be voted separately?
 
Kreso said:
Do you know, my swiss friend, if all questions (retreat of gold reserves, ban of gold sales and rule that snb must hold 20% of reserves in gold) at referendum would be voted together or each question would be voted separately?
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Great question :mrt:

The proposal is gonna be voted on as a whole. It can't be split up.
However, the executive government ("Bundesrat") and the parliamentary chambers (house/"Nationalrat" and senate/"Ständerat") will likely come up with a counter proposal that is going to be voted on as an alternative choice on the ballot. This way, they could change some of the harsher parts of the intiative like the prohibition of sales even above the 20% reserves mark or the total ban of storage abroad. I can imagine that they'll come up with a similar proposal like the German Bundesbank did. I.e. a multi-year partial repatriation plan.
The difference in the case of Switzerland is, however, that it's not up to politicians to decide which version will become law. It's solely up to the people.

This means that in the end, it's up to us to campaign hard to get our version accepted by the electorate. :judge:
 
Keith Barron said:
...
I would also like to point out two very developments taking place in Switzerland. A movement inside Switzerland has already acquired 100,000 signatures for two things to be put on the ballot. The first one would eliminate any future sales by the Swiss National Bank.

But the second, and far more compelling measure, would be for Switzerland to buy back 1,000 tons of gold that it has already sold. To get 1,000 tons of physical gold in this market is going to be a Herculean task, and it is certainly going to vault the price of gold much higher than current levels. This will be a very interesting situation to watch unfold in the physical gold market.
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http://kingworldnews.com/kingworldn...y_A_Stunning_1,000_Tons_Of_Physical_Gold.html

Whoa.
 
Yes they would have to buy 1000 tons. But over 5 years, ie 200 tons a year.
Until they intitiave passes, it's likely going to be more, because the SNB is printing money to weaken the CHF, ie the balance sheet is growing rapidly. They're intervening right now in EUR/CHF.
 
swissaustrian said:
Yes they would have to buy 1000 tons. But over 5 years, ie 200 tons a year.
...
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Yeah, but just think about how the rumors of Cyprus' tiny 10 tons sale crashed the gold market (according to CNBC and other financial talking head idiots). Surely 20 times that amount would have a dramatic effect, no?
 
I don't know. China is buying 80+ tons a month and nobody seems to notice. It boils down to media attention I guess. Ultimately it boilds down to fundamentals, though, and it's obviously going to impact supply. The repatriation of hundreds of tons within a required timeframe of the just two years is also a big deal.
 
I was being facetious in my last comment sa. I should have included a smilie I guess. The (financial) media like to trumpet certain stories as cause and effect, but a lot of it is complete bullshit.
 
PMBug said:
Yeah, but just think about how the rumors of Cyprus' tiny 10 tons sale crashed the gold market (according to CNBC and other financial talking head idiots). Surely 20 times that amount would have a dramatic effect, no?
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NO, PMBug, all the news re: gold are only working to the downside :rotflmbo:
 
The SNB announced today that 70% of all Swiss gold is stored inside Switzerland already. 20% is stored (probably leased) in London, 10% is with the Bank of Canada. None is in NY with the NY FED.

While this is a pleasant surprise (if true), it is remarkable for two reasons:
1. It's the first time EVER that the SNB publicly disclosed it's storage concept. That is the first success of the gold initiative.
2. The fact that there is ZERO gold in the US probably a consequence of the Gold Wars ( http://www.pmbug.com/forum/f2/my-top-3-gold-books-253/ ) between the US and Switzerland during the late 1990s and early 2000s. Switzerland was forced to sell half of it's gold. I bet you a lot that this half was stored in NY. Now the SNB won't store any in gold in the US anylonger.
 
Do you have to take their word for it, or is someone (independent) going to audit that claim?
 
The Swiss federal government on Wednesday rejected a right-wing political initiative known as “Save our Swiss gold," which sought to restrict the country’s independent central bank’s ability to sell and control gold, and urged lawmakers to vote down the measure.
...
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http://www.ibtimes.com/switzerland-...rebuff-central-bank-gold-restrictions-1478936

It's a little unclear what the report is saying. If the government "rejected the initiative" and the rest of the article refers to it in the past tense, why is there still a vote pending?
 
Turd says referendum vote is November 30:
...
As this issue comes to the forefront this autumn, you will need to be aware of the circumstances surrounding the vote. ...

First, here are two bits of background from earlier this year. From former US Budget Director David Stockman we have this: http://davidstockmanscontracorner.c...anic-at-gold-initiative-to-yoke-central-bank/

And from the FinancialSense website, we have this interview of Luzi Stamm, who is one of the Swiss parliamentarians behind the initiative: http://www.financialsense.com/contributors/luzi-stamm/swiss-gold-initiative-revolution-europe

Last week, Swiss money manager Egon von Greyerz brought the issue back to our attention and I urge you to take a moment to read this brief commentary: http://goldswitzerland.com/swiss-to-vote-on-gold-repatriation-in-november/#more-16773
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http://www.tfmetalsreport.com/blog/6065/swiss-gold-initiative
 
I heard various figures, so I'm not sure whether it's really 20 %... even so, that's a nice number!

Most countries have either no gold at all or have 1 % or so...
 
This swiss vote is making people nervous.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-...iss-bullion-referendum-passes.html?cmpid=yhoo

"The proposal from the “Save Our Swiss Gold” proponents is simple: Force the central bank to build its bullion position up to at least 20 percent of total assets from 8 percent today. Holding 522 billion Swiss francs ($544 billion) of assets in its coffers, the Swiss National Bank would have to buy at least 1,500 tons of gold, costing about $56.3 billion at current prices, to get to the required threshold by 2019."

“They can print money from noon until night,” said Luzi Stamm, one of the initiators. “But if they do, they’ll have to hold a portion as bullion.”

:popcorn:
 
I have been reading an awful lot about this subject lately. In fact, I have read so much that I can almost feel the narrow defeat as if it had already happened. There is NO WAY the PTB, along with the central bankers and Brotherhood of Darkness will permit this to pass. That gold is gone and there is nothing the Swiss People can do about it. Now, be a good subject, shut the fuck up and get back in line, because circus tickets go on sale quite soon, and you don't want to miss out.

That said, if this does somehow miraculously pass, the immediately following chaos in metals markets will be beyond epic, as the PTB smash silver and gold like nothing the world has ever witnessed. In fact, I would be willing to wager quite the tidy sum that upon the unlikely passage of this, gold and silver will be so ruthlessly pummeled that the paper markets break completely and all trading i n precious metals is suspended world-wide for some period as the temper tantrum throwing banksters figure out what the fuck to do. Meanwhile, those who stock up and are ready, will need to be tightly buckled in, since the decoupling of futures paper markets means metals will freely trade and actually trade hands in physical form, while price discovery becomes something closer to what it is supposed to be derived from: true supply and demand.
 
It looks the initiative is not going to pass. All major lobby groups (political parties, state governments, unions, business associations, media) are against it. The media is all out propagandizing slogans like it would "cost jobs", "jeopardize the eur/chf floor", "only help foreign speculators" and "dimish the independence of the SNB". Polls are showing a slight lead of the yes camp, but the lead is so small that it usually shifts into a no shortly before the vote. There is a big camp of undecided voters and they usually predominantly go for no. Ancona is totally spot on with his feeling.
There was a 75 minutes debate on public television yesterday where two proponents debated the finance minister and a representative of a state government. It is all in German, but you can watch it here: http://www.srf.ch/sendungen/arena/abstimmungs-arena-gold-initiative
The opponents were well prepared, especially the finance minister. Her arguments were sometimes false and she even dropped the "conspiracy theory" bomb, but it was good politics from her. I think that the average voter might not really have been interested in the broadcast, though. The discussion got quite technical at times. Given that the representatives of the yes camp did not more than an average job, one has to hope that not too many voters will make their decision based on this debate.
 
Sorry to hear that SA. I'm still amazed the initiative made it a far as it has. I have a hard time thinking such an idea would gain much traction amongst the unwashed masses here in the USA. There is a whole subculture that celebrates "bling", but I don't give them much credit for really understanding why bling IS bling.
 
New polls are out today and it doesnt look good. Expect a no vote...
Since this is not the only issue that is being voted on in two weeks, there is also no chance that the no camp might just get lazy and not turn out to vote.
 
Tomorrow is the big day. Expect the worst, hope for the best...

By 8-9 am ET, perliminary results will already be in. I'll probably post an update if my wife and kids let me :)
 
Well, it was fun dreaming about it, but I think we all knew it would never happen.

They probably didn't want to get Husseined or Gadhafied.
 
So does this mean it will tumble further or had it already tumbled assuming it would fail?
 
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